Gauging U.S. upset over the conversion bill http://blogs.jta.org/ENTRY_PERMALINK_HERE/gauging-us-upset-over-the-conversion-bill/ David Harris of the American Jewish Committee and Tablet’s Alana Newhouse slam the conversion bill. en-us aeden@jta.org Copyright 2010 2010-07-19T;19:38:00-05:00 Comment by Robert Lefkowitz bobbyl1396@yahoo.com To the ref and con movements - wouldn’t it be alot easier to admit that you are not strong-willed enough to be an observant Jew but that you can always aspire to do more instead of fooling yourselves by thinking that you are righteous tzadikkim who loves Gd and Jews? Not everybody can be 100% observant (I’m sure not). But to admit that you are a sinner and will try to become better is waaaaaay better than diluting the real Judaism and calling yourselves righteous. And the proof is in the pudding. In 1, 2 or 3 generations none of your offspring will be Jewish (maybe even anti-semites) so we’ll just wait it out, I guess. To the ref and con movements - wouldn’t it be alot easier to admit that you are not strong-willed enough to be an observant Jew but that you can always aspire to do more instead of fooling yourselves by thinking that you are righteous tzadikkim who loves Gd and Jews?

Not everybody can be 100% observant (I’m sure not). But to admit that you are a sinner and will try to become better is waaaaaay better than diluting the real Judaism and calling yourselves righteous.

And the proof is in the pudding. In 1, 2 or 3 generations none of your offspring will be Jewish (maybe even anti-semites) so we’ll just wait it out, I guess.

]]> 2012-05-24T;14:04:00-05:00 Comment by Robert Lefkowitz bobbyl1396@yahoo.com What an insult. How someone can compare this law with the Nuremberg laws is beyond the pale. In an age where it is becoming increasingly difficult to determine who is and who is not Jewish and with refugees from other countries pretending that they are Jewish, this bill is timely and necessary. Up until a couple hundred years ago, there were only orthodox Jews. It would be shocking for me to find even one offspring of the pregenitors of the reform and conservatives movements to still be Jewish. Ref and Con movements are blasphemy, calling good evil and evil good. When you bring your Talmudic “proofs” to confirm your twisted argument you are only showing your own ignorance. Bottom line - Ref and Con Jews do not care about real Judasim. The people at the top of these movements have children who marry out of the faith even as they preach their commitment to Judaism. Maybe it is because they would like to tell themselves and their grandchildren, great-grandchildren that they really are Jewish no matter what the rabbis say. You, Mr. Sarna, are an idiot. What an insult. How someone can compare this law with the Nuremberg laws is beyond the pale. In an age where it is becoming increasingly difficult to determine who is and who is not Jewish and with refugees from other countries pretending that they are Jewish, this bill is timely and necessary.

Up until a couple hundred years ago, there were only orthodox Jews. It would be shocking for me to find even one offspring of the pregenitors of the reform and conservatives movements to still be Jewish. Ref and Con movements are blasphemy, calling good evil and evil good.

When you bring your Talmudic “proofs” to confirm your twisted argument you are only showing your own ignorance.

Bottom line - Ref and Con Jews do not care about real Judasim. The people at the top of these movements have children who marry out of the faith even as they preach their commitment to Judaism. Maybe it is because they would like to tell themselves and their grandchildren, great-grandchildren that they really are Jewish no matter what the rabbis say.

You, Mr. Sarna, are an idiot.

]]> 2012-05-24T;14:04:00-05:00 Comment by David E Y Sarna david@hshco.com Personally, I believe that one is a Jew if born from a Jewish mother or converted in a halachic conversion. That said, I agree with Alana Newhouse and David Harris, that the proposed conversion bill would be poor public policy. On this Tish’a B’av, we are all reminded of the story in the Talmud, Gittin 55-56 which tells us that the second temple was only destroyed because of “sin’at hinom,” (baseless hatred) of Jews against Jews. While the left is certainly as guilty of this sin as the right, two wrongs do not a right make. There are enough enemies of Israel that the Jewish people of all walks of life need to bond together for strength.  We somehow survived very well for over 60 years without the State of Israel challenging conversion credentials from abroad, a business no state should engage in. I hope that the Government will heed the wise words of one the the great Israeli patriots of our generation, and now the Chairman of the Jewish Agency, Natan Sharansky, and send this ill-considered bill to the Geniza, the place where the Rabbis busied “d’varim sotrim divrai Torah,” things that contradict the words of the Torah (in this case, the enticement of baseless hatred, one Jew towards another. Personally, I believe that one is a Jew if born from a Jewish mother or converted in a halachic conversion. That said, I agree with Alana Newhouse and David Harris, that the proposed conversion bill would be poor public policy. On this Tish’a B’av, we are all reminded of the story in the Talmud, Gittin 55-56 which tells us that the second temple was only destroyed because of “sin’at hinom,” (baseless hatred) of Jews against Jews. While the left is certainly as guilty of this sin as the right, two wrongs do not a right make.
There are enough enemies of Israel that the Jewish people of all walks of life need to bond together for strength.  We somehow survived very well for over 60 years without the State of Israel challenging conversion credentials from abroad, a business no state should engage in. I hope that the Government will heed the wise words of one the the great Israeli patriots of our generation, and now the Chairman of the Jewish Agency, Natan Sharansky, and send this ill-considered bill to the Geniza, the place where the Rabbis busied “d’varim sotrim divrai Torah,” things that contradict the words of the Torah (in this case, the enticement of baseless hatred, one Jew towards another.

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